[JD Smith]

Steve Culver, on 07 July 2010 - 10:58 PM, said:

WOW! Type this into a search engine and see what you get. I feel dumb again.

Yeah... it gets pretty thick, pretty quick. But, I'm getting enough from it to understand how and why this kerosene thing works.

[JD Smith]

Hey guys,
I found this article that more or less simply explains the process.;

http://www.sciencecl...n-Reaction.html

[ABS Webmaster]

JD:

Thank you!

I clicked the link and read the article. It was helpful to my understanding of the process.

Thanks for posting it for us.

[Jarrett L Rhodes]

I am new to pattern welding. I have worked up a couple of cable billets using kerosene and actually made my first billet of random pattern this last week. Using the kerosene worked great for me. I had read the guidance here and applied it. I have little experience with using other fluxes and since this is working for me; if it ain't broke don't fix it.

[Bob Kramer]

Great info.

Why not spray the billet with WD40? Wouldn't that act the same way as kerosene?

Bob Kramer

[Steve Culver]

Hey Bob,

I think the WD-40 might work just fine, though I haven’t tried it. But, I know of a couple of smiths who spray their cold damascus billets with WD-40 to make their borax flux stick to it. So, I’m guessing that at least there isn’t any reason that the WD-40 would cause a problem. Let us know how it works, if you try it.

[Bob Kramer]

I've got a billet in the works right now. I'll stretch it cut it wd it several times and let you know how it turns out. The first go round seemed perfect.
BK

[Bob Kramer]

I put together 2 billets of 01 and 15n20 (small stack 8 pieces each) today and I did not clean the scale off the 01 before tacking it together. I let them cool and sprayed one down with WD40 and the other did nothing to it. I brought them up to welding with a rich flame in the forge and put them under the hammer to set the weld. Both billets had a solid feel so back into the forge for a soak then back under the hammer for another set, no edge forging at this point then back into the forge for another soak. Third go round I got after them hard and aggressively drew them out and straightened the edges out. The billet that had the WD40 had zero problems and the "dry stack" had just a little area close to the edges that did not take. Both billets were then ground clean with a side arm grinder, cut, restacked and rewelded in the forge in the same manner described above with the same results. Conclusion; you do not need flux to forge weld as long as you have the proper atmosphere and technique. I believe the addition of WD 40 or kerosene makes it even easier and should prevent potential flux inclusions.

Bob Kramer

Here is a picture of the test billet, materials 15N20, O1, 1080, no borax used only WD 40

[Don Hanson]

Bob, thanks for adding that. Wasn't very impressed the first time, but I'll have to give the WD40/Kero another try.... When it cools down!

[Mace Vitale]

Hey fellas,
So I decided to give this a try. So far so good. It's been a while since I've made any steel, the first billet I tried I got a couple of bad spots, but I know what the problem was. The steel I used was thin layers and I forgot to tack the sides of the billet so as it was heating it started to open up and kind of burn the outer layers. Tried another billet(a little go-mai) and it came out fine. Welded up 4 billets the other day using kero for the first weld then used a little borax on the edges for a "second" weld. Everything looks good so far and it really felt like a solid billet the first time I hit it. Hope to get them clean, stacked, tacked, and welded a few more times this week. I'll let ya know how it goes.
I'll tell ya this....LOVE the fact there are no burn holes in my clothes!
Mace

[Steve Culver]

I use kerosene all of the time now, with a second welding pass using a little borax. Always works great. And not getting burned so much, or setting something in the shop on fire IS an added plus.

[Tom Dunn]

OK Mace or Steve this is great to hear. Do you dunk the billet, or spritz it or what, if you don't mind me asking?
Thanks.
Tom

[Mace Vitale]

Hey Tom,
I just dunked the whole billet in the kero for a min. or so, just so I didnt see any more air bubbles come up.
Mace

[Steve Culver]

Ditto what Mace said. If its a high layer count billet, or complcated layers of any kind, I make sure that it gets a good soak to be sure the kero gets all throught it. Then, out of the kerosene bath and straight into the forge; wet as possible.

[Tom Dunn]

WoW! Thanks to you both. Will try it soon!

[Angus Wright]

have any of you heard of a welding compound called Z weld?
any additional info on it appreciated.

Thanks, Angus

[Steve Culver]

Z Weld is sold by Larry Zoeller. I've never used it. Larry has some interesting material on his site. Hope he doesn't mind me attaching his link to this post. Zoeller Forge